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Posts: 1784
Oct 8 13 10:53 AM
whoswhoz wrote:Generally, I strongly support the concept that Schiff did things first and Weisinger stole from him. See my article "Schiff Came First" here.http://dccomicsartists.com/vault/Schiff%20came%20first.htmBut when Schiff's assistant editor George Kashdan was interviewed for Alter Ego he basically disavowed any knowledge of the Martian Manhunter and claimed the whole thing was Weisinger's idea. It's all still very muddled in my head, but apparently Weisinger edited all the John Jones stories up until 1959 when the Manhunter was revealed to the world and became a regular super-hero. The writer credits of these early stories are also pretty mixed up because people (like me) have been trying to shoe horn them into the Schiff stable instead of the Weisinger stable. I currently don't think any of the pre 1959 stories were written by Jack Miller.I just haven't had the time or energy to go back and read them over again. Maybe since I don't have anything else to do (government furlough) I might give it a try soon.
Posts: 4563
Oct 8 13 10:55 AM
seattleguy wrote: Actually, I was a fan of Lee Elias and I liked the work that he did on Tommy Tomorrow in the Showcase books. On Adam Strange he could hardly be faulted for the story lines and it may not have been his idea to eliminate the very recognizable fin from Adam's headgear which was so much a part of his uniform...But if he WAS the guy who was responsible for it's removal then tarring and feathering him at his drawing board would have been a fitting punishment.
sterlling wrote: Lee Elias name has come up on the boards and this thread and is given a thumbs down by many and yet if you are aware of the back issue market he's sought after pretty solidly for his work at Harvey comics in the 1950's on things like Black Cat,Chamber of Chills,the many romance series,etc...including having produced a number of classic pre code covers that cost a mint today.Nothing wrong with not liking someone's work of coarse but it is interesting from my perspective.
Yossarian wrote: I like the fact that he apparently got under Fredrick Wetham's skin with his Black Cat books. His Tommy Tomorrow work was very good, but no one could top Infantino on Adam Strange, and he didn't.
Oct 8 13 11:07 AM
lelak wrote: What I really liked, though, was the Elongated Man feature (and especially Infantino's art, when he inked himself).
Oct 8 13 11:10 AM
sterlling wrote: Perhaps the biggest irony with Bat-woman is she was supposed to be a sort of love interest for Batman to fight the gay rumors the character had coming off of the SOTI era (if that's true) and in our times I understand she's now gay. My how times have changed...
Posts: 1894
Oct 8 13 11:27 AM
Hepcat wrote:lelak wrote: What I really liked, though, was the Elongated Man feature (and especially Infantino's art, when he inked himself).I really didn't like the way the Elongated Man feature looked with Carmine Infantino inking himself. As a twelve year old at the time I wasn't aware of the concept of inking but I certainly wondered how and why the Elongated Man looked so good in the Flash while the Elongated Man stories looked so awful in Detective Comics.
Oct 8 13 11:33 AM
Posts: 7571
Oct 8 13 1:19 PM
Golden Age
TODD TAMANEND CLARK Poet/Composer/Multi-Instrumentalist/Cultural Historian The Monongahela River, Turtle Island
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Posts: 8154
Oct 8 13 1:22 PM
Oct 8 13 1:46 PM
Oct 8 13 2:11 PM
TODD TAMANEND CLARK wrote: BATWOMAN should have been given her own new look comic book drawn by SID GREENE and/or WALLACE WOOD!
Oct 8 13 2:33 PM
Oct 8 13 2:57 PM
Posts: 809
Oct 8 13 5:30 PM
Posts: 248
Oct 9 13 6:38 AM
Oct 9 13 11:57 AM
Yossarian wrote:...the gimmicks that worked with Superman just were not as effective with Batman. For that reason, I was ready for the "New Look" to come along by mid-1964. I know a lot of you do not agree.sterling wrote:Hey, I'm curious what the reaction was to the "new look" of the Batman when some of you original buyers of the comics saw him for the first time....I've always preferred the original bat on the chest without the yellow oval around it. I thought the original looked better and the later had to much of a cheese look for my tastes.I absolutely love Sheldon Moldoff's work in comics and on Batman but looking back he seemed better suited to the 40's & 50's art styles where as Carmine worked well for the 60's style of comics. What did you guys think back in 64'? Seattleguy wrote:I thought the new look Batman was a big improvement over the all the sci-fi crap and the stiff artwork that had been the norm for several years prior.I was just turning twelve when the New Look Batman hit the stands. I initially didn't know what to think of it but I soon decided I didn't like this new look.First of all, I thought the yellow oval around his bat logo wasn't just unnecessary, but was incongruous too. Batman's costume had always been blue and grey. What was the oval intended to match? His utility belt?Secondly, Carmine Infantino wasn't the right artist for Batman just as Lee Elias wasn't the right artist to take on the Adam Strange feature after Carmine Infantino. Batman should look edgy and menacing, while Infantino's Batman looked rather wimpy to me. I think Irv Novick or Dick Dillin who did such a good job on Batman in the seventies would have been better choices for the New Look Batman.Finally, I liked the Batman mythos that Jack Schiff had built up over the years, i.e. the Batcave, Batplane, Bat-Mite, Batwoman, Bat-Girl, Bat-Hound, Vicki Vale, the various colourful villains, etc. Julius Schwartz dispensed of all these with the exception of some of the villains.Seattleguy wrote:Then the Batman TV show and all that camp garbage really set the character back again.whoswhoz wrote:The quality of the writing went steadily down hill also- until by the time of the Batman tv show, it, like most other DC's of the day, had become unreadable. And then within two years the Batman titles had been camped down to ape the execrable character on the TV show! It's not their fault you say? Well it happened on their watch! Why should I not blame Julius Schwartz and Carmine Infantino for their portrayal of Batman as a buffoon?Worse yet, Julius Schwartz also cavalierly dumbed down other titles in which Batman played a role to more closely mimic the flavour of the TV show:
sterling wrote:Hey, I'm curious what the reaction was to the "new look" of the Batman when some of you original buyers of the comics saw him for the first time....I've always preferred the original bat on the chest without the yellow oval around it. I thought the original looked better and the later had to much of a cheese look for my tastes.I absolutely love Sheldon Moldoff's work in comics and on Batman but looking back he seemed better suited to the 40's & 50's art styles where as Carmine worked well for the 60's style of comics. What did you guys think back in 64'?
Seattleguy wrote:I thought the new look Batman was a big improvement over the all the sci-fi crap and the stiff artwork that had been the norm for several years prior.
Seattleguy wrote:Then the Batman TV show and all that camp garbage really set the character back again.
whoswhoz wrote:The quality of the writing went steadily down hill also- until by the time of the Batman tv show, it, like most other DC's of the day, had become unreadable.
Posts: 5254
Oct 9 13 4:11 PM
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Oct 9 13 4:29 PM
Oct 10 13 11:37 AM
Hepcat wrote:Finally, I liked the Batman mythos that Jack Schiff had built up over the years ... the various colourful villains. Julius Schwartz dispensed of all these with the exception of some of the villains.
Oct 10 13 11:55 AM
Oct 10 13 12:22 PM
Hepcat wrote:
In retrospect, I think Schwartz's original intention to dispense of all the costumed crooks. After all, they were only reintroduced into the comic mag after they made their TV appearances, and then only those that had appeared on the TV show. The ones who never appeared on the TV show such as Cat-Man, Clayface, Firefly, Sea-Fox, the Fox, Shark and the Vulture, etc. never reappeared at all.
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