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Grendel Mapping

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tsobel	Grendel Mapping	Lead	[-]
Posts: 404 Feb 5 07 4:36 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None I have been enjoying reading the messages on this board and have begun planning several binding projects. For practice, I tried mapping the main Grendel storyline. My assumptions are that: 1) Announced hardbacks for Devil by Deed (the story told in Mage) and the original mini-series & primers cover those stories. 2) The announced but unsceduled 8-issue Hunter Rose series with be collected in hardback so wouln't need binding. 3) Skipped the Grendel Tales mini-series Book I (Hunter Rose/20 issues): Grendel Classics #1-2 (double size), Black White and Red #1-4, Red White and Black #1-4, Silverback #1-3, Batman Grendel I #1-2, Grendel: Devils Quest one-shot, Batman/Grendel #1-2, Book II (Legacy/21 issues) - Grendel: Devils Child #1-2, Grendel: Devils Legacy TPB (Christine Spar -Grendel #1-12), Grendel #13-15 (Brian Ling), Devil's Whisper (non-Wagner short story from A-1 #4), Grendel #20-23 (incubation). Book III (Church & State/17 issues) - Grendel #24-40 (Eppy Thatcher/Orion Assante)
chasdom	Re: Grendel Mapping	#1	[-]
Posts: 846 Feb 6 07 7:33 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Grendel: War Child #1-10 (originally intended to be Grendel #41-50) featuring Juptier Assante and the android Grendel. The android is then featured in Grendel: Devil's Quest and Batman/Grendel II, which would be a 13-issue volume and would leave your first volume lighter. Not sure where to go from there, but I think you would have to make it 4 volumes. --chasdom
tsobel	Re: Grendel Mapping	#2	[-]
Posts: 404 Feb 7 07 12:11 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Good point on Volume IV. I originally did not include War Child because I already have the Dark Horse hard cover edition. But for the sake of anyone else wanting to use the map, here is how a four volume set could work using your idea. Book I (Hunter Rose/17 issues): Grendel Classics #1-2 (double size), Black White and Red #1-4, Red White and Black #1-4, Silverback #1-3, Batman Grendel I #1-2, Book II (Legacy/21.25 issues) - Grendel: Devils Child #1-2, Grendel: Devils Legacy TPB (Christine Spar -Grendel #1-12), Grendel #13-15 (Brian Ling), Devil's Whisper (non-Wagner short story from A-1 #4), Grendel #20-23 (Incubation). Book III (Church & State/17 issues) - Grendel #24-40 (Eppy Thatcher/Orion Assante) Book IV (Grendel-Prime/18 issues) - Grendel: War Child #1-10, Grendel Tales: Homecoming #1-5, Grendel: Devils Quest one-shot, Batman/Grendel II #1-2 Homecoming is a Grendel Tales book that continues the story of the green haired female warrior from War Child. It would fit into a Grendel prime book nicely to fill out that volume.
tsobel	Re: Grendel Mapping	#3	[-]
Posts: 404 Feb 7 07 12:17 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Also, I would not include Volume numbers on the book spine. With the new Hunter Rose mini-seires and Wagner's talk of an eventual grand finale to that story storyline, there will probably be enough new Hunter Rose material to fill a volume between Vol. I & II.
riftt	Re: Grendel Mapping	#4	[-]
Posts: 2797 Mar 16 07 7:06 PM Registered Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I wouldnt include the black/white/red etc, least of all because of rumoured hardcovers announced. what about putting vol. 2 16-19 in the first volume and saving grendel classics for a seperate volume with the dark horse reprints?
tsobel	Re: Grendel Mapping	#5	[-]
Posts: 404 Mar 20 07 10:44 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I ended up picking up an inexpensive comic-sized version of Devil by the Deed. So I am leaning towards including that in the Hunter Rose volume to serve as an anchor and moving the Batman-grendel 2-parter to a second Hunter Rose volume. I am waiting a bit to see what is coming down the wire from Dark Horse for this anniversary year. So far I have only heard about the new HR mini-series, the Devil By Deed HB, and the Archives HB. I had not heard that they were hardbacking the BW&R mini-series. A good part of my motivation is in getting into binding is to get rid of my long boxes. so I am not sure that my plans would change even if DH realeases a BW&R collection. Especially given the small page count. IMHO, it is surprising that they did not combine the archives and Devil by Deed into a single book.
riftt	Re: Grendel Mapping	#6	[-]
Posts: 2797 Mar 20 07 5:15 PM Registered Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	there has been talk of a slipcased hardcover edition of the two b/w/r books (mentioned in CBR interviews), as well as a hardcover of the recoloured God and the Devil (jk snyder mentioned this when I asked at this past SDCC) and Devil's Reign Also not sure about including Batman/Grendel II and Devils Quest in with the Hunter Rose stuff. Sure it is the focus of Grendel Prime's quest but the timeline of the material itself is far-removed for the HR stories and to me at least would be better served around war child and four devils, one hell. Also for the Hunter Rose book, wasnt there a story of his in the comico black book? I think binding Grendel would be a great project regardless of the announced hardcovers because of the great letters pages
tsobel	Re: Grendel Mapping	#7	[-]
Posts: 404 Mar 20 07 5:49 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Check out the second version of the map (3rd post). I created a "Prime" collection with Quest, Batman II, War Child and Homecoming. Good news about most of the Comico stuff going into hardback. Hopefully, these great stories will reach a new audience.
tsobel	Re: Grendel bibliography	#8	[-]
Posts: 404 Mar 20 07 6:04 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	And here is the bibliography of all thing Grendel. www.mattwagnercomics.com/...raphy.html 1/82: Primer #2 (Short story Grendel features the first appearance of Grendel and Argent [Comico]) 3/83 Grendel #1-3 (Mini-series in black and white [Comico] {3/83-2/84}) 2/84 Mage #1-15 (Maxi-series [Comico: 2/84-12/86). Issues #6-14 feature Grendel color back-ups.) 10/86 Grendel: Devil by the Deed (Oversize TPB reprinting of the Grendel back-up story serialized in Mage #6-14 [Comico]) 10/86 Grendel #1-40: Legacy #1-12 Brian Li #13-15 Hunter Rose #16-19 Devil is... #20-23 Eppy Thatcher #24-33 Orion #34-40 Issue #40 is a flip book featuring the first Grendel Tale Devil Worship <w>Steve Seagle <a>Che Anderson. TPB Devils Legacy collects 1-12 TPB Devil Inside collects 13-15 10/87 Grendel: Devils Vagary (A 16-page black, white, and red comic originally distributed as part of the Comico Collection <a>Dean Motter [Comico]. Reprinted in the Grendel: Black, White, and Red TPB.) 10/89 Silverback #1-3 (Mini-series featuring the origin of Argent from Grendel <co-w>William Messner-Loebs <a>John Peck [Comico] {10/89-12/89}) 6/90 A-1 #4 (Short Grendel Tale Grendel: Devils Whisper <w>James Robinson <a>Disraeli [Atomeka]) 8/92 Grendel: War Child #1-10 (<a>Patrick McEown [Dark Horse] {8/92-6/93}) TPB collects 1-10 8/92 San Diego Comic-Con Comics #1 (Jam issue featuring a humorous 1-page Grendel piece <co-a>Tim Sale [Dark Horse]) 7/93 Grendel: Devil by the Deed (Standard-size comic reprint of the back-up story from Mage #6-14 with a new artist gallery [Dark Horse]) 8/93 Grendel Tales: Four Devils, One Hell #1-6 (Mini-series <w>James Robinson <a>Teddy Kristiansen [Dark Horse]{8/93-1/94}) TPB collects 1-6 8/93 Batman/Grendel: Devils Riddle (Part one of two [DC/Comico]) 8/93 Grendel/Batman: Devils Masque (Part two of two [Comico/DC]) 1993 Grendel (A free black & white booklet that was included within distributor Capital Citys Advance Comics magazine. It includes three features: The History Of Grendel: Devil In Reflection <w>Steve Seagle; Original Grendel Story <a>Matt Wagner, Bernie Mireault, John K. Snyder III, and Tim Sale; and a Matt Wagner bibliography [Dark Horse]. Note that a limited variant edition (425 copies) was included within the Grendel Kit.) 2/94 Grendel Tales: Devils Hammer #1-3 (Mini-series <w>Rob Walton <a>Bernie Mireault/Kathryn Delaney [Dark Horse]{2/94-4/94}. Issue #1 features the beginning of the Devils Quest back-up Serial.) 5/94 Grendel Tales: The Devil in Our Midst #1-5 (Mini-series <w>Steve Seagle <a>Paul Grist [Dark Horse]{5/94-9/94}. Continues the Devils Quest back-up serial.) TPB collects 1-5 8/94 San Diego Comic-Con Comics #3 (Features a 2-page Devil Quest primer/preview [Dark Horse]) 10/94 Grendel Tales: Devil and Deaths #1-2 (Mini-series <w>Darko Macan <a>Edvin Biukovic [Dark Horse]{10/94-11/94}. Continues the Devils Quest back-up serial.) TPB Devils and Deaths collects 1-2 and Devils Choices 1-4 12/94 Grendel Tales: Homecoming #1-3 (<w/a>Patrick McEown [Dark Horse] {12/94-2/95}. Continues the Devils Quest back-up serial. TPB collects 1-3 3/95 Grendel Tales: Devils Choices #1-4 (Mini-series <w>Darko Macan <w>Edvin Biukovic [Dark Horse]{3/95-6/95}. Issue #1 includes the last installment of the Devils Quest back-up serial.) TPB Devils and Deaths collects 1-4 and Devils and Deaths 1-2 7/95 Grendel Classics #1-2 (Re-colored reprints of Grendel #16-19 stories Devil Tracks and Devil Eyes [Dark Horse]{7/95-8/95}) TPB Devil Tales collects Devil Tracks and Devil Eyes 10/95 Grendel Cycle (Includes an alphabetical primer, story synopsis, and cover gallery [Dark Horse]) 11/95 Grendel: Devils Quest (Collects the serialized back-up story from Grendel Tales; it is a prelude (and epilogue) to the second Batman/Grendel x-over [Dark Horse]) 12/95 Grendel Tales: The Devil May Care #1-6 (Mini-series <w>Terry LaBan <a>Peter Doherty [Dark Horse]{12/95-5/96}) TPB collects 1-6 6/96 Batman/Grendel II, Book 1: Devils Bones (Part one of two [Dark Horse/DC]) 7/96 Grendel/Batman II, Book 2: Devils Dance (Part two of two [Dark Horse/DC]) 7/96 A Decade of Dark Horse #1 (Short story Grendel: The Devils Week [Dark Horse]) 9/97 Grendel Tales: The Devils Apprentice #1-3 (Mini-series <w>Jeffrey Lang <a>Steve Lieber [Dark Horse]{9/97-11/97}) 11/98 Grendel: Black, White, & Red #1-4 (An anthology of black, white, and red short stories featuring Hunter Rose <a>various [Dark Horse]{11/98-2/99}) TPB collects 1-4 plus the Grendel: Devils Vagary story from the Comico Collection 6/99 Grendel: Devil Child #1-2 (Grendel Tales story <w>Diane Schutz <a>Tim Sale/Teddy Kristiansen [Dark Horse]{6/99-8/99}) 3/00 Grendel: Devils Legacy #1-12 (Remastered reprint of Grendel #1-12 from the original series <a>the Pander Bros. [Dark Horse]{3/00-2/01}) TPB collects 1-12 7/00 Grendel: Past Prime (Illustrated novel <w>Greg Rucka [Dark Horse])) 7/01 Dark Horse Maverick 2001 (Short story Grendel: Devils Duel [Dark Horse]) 7/01 Occupational Hazards #2 (Short story The Devils @$$hole <a>Rick Beckley [CD Comics/CBLDF]) 9/01 Grendel: The Devil Inside #1-3 (Remastered reprint of Grendel #13-15 <a>Bernie Mireault [Dark Horse]{9/01-11/01})) TPB collects 1-3 7/02 Dark Horse Extra #49-50 (Free fold-out preview includes the short story Grendel: Scared Of The Devil (Midnight Looms) [Dark Horse]{7/02-8/02}) 9/02 Grendel: Red, White, & Black #1-4 (Short story anthology <a>various [Dark Horse]{9/02-12/02}) TPB collects 1-4 plus Devils Week from A Decade Of Dark Horse #1, Scared Of The Devil from Dark Horse Extra #49-50, and Devils Duel from Dark Horse Maverick 2001 1/03 Grendel: God and the Devil #0-10 (Remastered reprinting of Grendel #23-33 <a>various [Dark Horse]{1/03-12/03}) 5/04 Grendel: Devils Reign #1-7 (Remastered reprinting of Grendel #34-40 <a>Tim Sale [Dark Horse]{5/04-12/04})
riftt	Re: Grendel bibliography	#9	[-]
Posts: 2797 Mar 20 07 6:44 PM Registered Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I've always wondered why the grendel tales Devil's Hammer was not collected as a tpb
jdunbar		#10	[-]
Posts: 356 Mar 19 10 12:03 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Holy crap, that's a lot of material to sift through. With all of the reprints, it looks so convoluted. Beware of Fanboy \| Deviant Art Gallery \|
jhalbright		#11	[-]
Posts: 9971 Mar 19 10 12:50 PM Golden Age Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	jdunbar wrote: ... it looks so convoluted. As opposed to Spider-Man? X-Men? Wolverine? Superman? Batman? The Black Lantern Saga? I have all the Grendel issues, and bagged/boarded, it only takes up one short box. All total, there are less Grendel comics than the last two years of the interconnected Superman storyline. And it's about the same as the Sinestro Corps War through Black Lantern Corps storyline. The biggest problem is the timeline. The different Grendels are set at different times. But it's not hard to figure out, really. (BTW - that above list stops at 2004. There were one (two?) new minis published after that.) I recommend: Vertigo - Fables, Fairest, Unwritten; DCnU - Action, All Star Western, Animal Man, Batman, Batman & Robin, Batman Inc, Batwoman, Earth 2, Flash, Justice League Dark, Swamp Thing, Wonder Woman; Before Watchmen - All
jdunbar		#12	[-]
Posts: 356 Mar 19 10 1:38 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I didn't mean convoluted in regards to continuity - just as far as what's reprints, what's original material, what's been reprinted and where. Should I even bother seeking out the individual issues, or am I better off just getting Dark Horse's TPBs? Beware of Fanboy \| Deviant Art Gallery \|
Grumpus		#13	[-]
Posts: 133 Mar 19 10 1:50 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I actually just checked this today before reading this post, but the original Comico issues #20-22 aren't going to be reprinted due to poor quality of the original art, so if you can grab those issues you should do so. I think the rest, besides Silverback, is reprinted in some way, shape, or form. And Silverback also can't be reprinted for similar reasons.
jdunbar		#14	[-]
Posts: 356 Mar 19 10 2:41 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	What's the timeline/best reading order for the various Tales minis? Beware of Fanboy \| Deviant Art Gallery \|
fubarthepanda		#15	[-]
Posts: 8818 Mar 19 10 3:38 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I love Matt Wagner and I love Grendel, but I agree that collected edition strategy for this work has been perplexing. I was hoping that after the NEXUS ARCHIVES series began, that we'd get something similar for GRENDEL, but nothing outside of some random mini-hardcovers (including a ridiculously low print run on the Batman/Grendel book). One day...
riftt		#16	[-]
Posts: 2797 Mar 19 10 5:16 PM Registered Member Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	n/m
jhalbright		#17	[-]
Posts: 9971 Mar 19 10 5:54 PM Golden Age Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	fubarthepanda wrote: I love Matt Wagner and I love Grendel, but I agree that collected edition strategy for this work has been perplexing. I was hoping that after the NEXUS ARCHIVES series began, that we'd get something similar for GRENDEL, but nothing outside of some random mini-hardcovers (including a ridiculously low print run on the Batman/Grendel book). One day... Ditto. This series celebrated it's 25th anniversary with little fanfare. I believe that certain plans were made, and some items did come out (Art of Grendel, 25th anniversary coin, a new statue, etc), but ultimately the comics didn't get a full Archive style reprinting. Now, luckily enough for fans, the series is easily found on the cheap, but still... BTW - I still haven't bound my Grendel comics I recommend: Vertigo - Fables, Fairest, Unwritten; DCnU - Action, All Star Western, Animal Man, Batman, Batman & Robin, Batman Inc, Batwoman, Earth 2, Flash, Justice League Dark, Swamp Thing, Wonder Woman; Before Watchmen - All
Big Bad Voodoo Lou		#18	[-]
Posts: 65 Mar 22 10 5:42 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I have several Grendel issues if anyone needs them for binding or collecting purposes: Grendel #16-19 (the Hunter Rose stories later collected in the rare Devil Tales TPB), Silverback #1-3, Devil Child #1-2, Red White and Black #1-4, all four Batman/Grendel books, as well as the earlier Comico printing of the Devil Inside TPB. Most of mine are signed by Matt Wagner, too.
tsobel		#19	[-]
Posts: 404 Mar 22 10 11:30 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Weird seeing one of my first posting resurrected after all this time. I probably would not have cut and paste so much today. Still, I have always enjoyed exchanging ideas about mapping. I ended up going with five volumes: Hunter rose color, Hunter rose black white and red, Legacy, Church and State, an Prime. Three are bound so far tow with nice sketches that I need to scan and post. I spoke with Matt Wagner at a show and he says to expect a Grendel-Prime story before too long so I have held off binding that volume. I would not worry too much about chronology. Think of Grendel in cycles -- each one focusing on a generation and containing a beginning and end.
James Friel		#20	[-]
Posts: 10355 Mar 23 10 4:00 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Cool. Prime is the thinnest volume by most maps, so a new story will fill that out nicely. Glad I've only got the first 3 volumes on the way back to me. Ah, the meek. Playing the long game. Sneaky bastards. --Denise Mina, Field of Blood

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